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What's the betting that Robert Prevost, aka 'Pope Leo XIV' will never proclaim a dogma - a truth revealed by God, proposed by the Church and to be believed by every Catholic? Faithful Catholics thanked God that in spite of his verbal diarrhea Jorge Bergoglio, aka 'Pope Francis', never did; and because the Mystical Body of Christ is indefectible, an informed guess says that neither will Prevost.
"Oh but," you say, "Pope Leo is universally, peacefully accepted by the Church. Just like Pope Francis." Yes, we heard that claimed about Bergoglio ad nauseam. "So Pope Leo could proclaim dogma and it would be infallible." No. Not necessarily.
For one thing, the papacy is bestowed not by cardinals but by Christ. Christ being Truth Itself cannot bestow the papacy on a man uncanonically elected, and the legality of the conclave that elected Prevost is questionable, to say the least. And for another thing, "Universal Peaceful Acceptance (UPA) is not a rule of faith. Bergoglio's multiple heresies were living proof that UPA is a myth, and Prevost's flirtations with LGBTQ ideologists such as transvestites and sodomites bid unfair to prove it all over again.
No matter how many bishops roll over and stay shtum, any papal pretender's lies (like the DDF's Note denying that Mary is Co-Redemptrix) are still lies. But Christ will always protect His Church by denying those lies the cloak of infallibility which can be worn only by solemn, ex cathedra definition.
| Like UPA, you better believe it ... |
From the formidable Chris Jackson at Hiareth in Exile:
Why “Universal Peaceful Acceptance” Can’t Save the Conciliar Church
Why “everyone agrees he’s pope” was never the Catholic rule of faith – and how that myth now props up a church that blesses sin and rewrites its own past.
If you’ve spent any time arguing with the new papalist influencers, you know the script.
“Leo XIV was universally accepted by the bishops. Paul VI was universally accepted. John Paul II, Benedict, Francis, Leo – all universally accepted. Therefore it is infallibly certain they were and are true popes.
Therefore anything they teach cannot truly contradict the pre-conciliar magisterium. Therefore if you think adulterers at Communion, blessings of homosexual couples, and the reversal on the death penalty clash with the prior faith, the problem is you.”
In other words, “universal peaceful acceptance” has become the magic spell that makes every contradiction vanish. The living episcopal club cannot be wrong about the man in white, so you must be wrong about what Trent, Pius V, Pius X, and Pius XII meant.
What almost no one bothers to do is ask the obvious question: where did this strong version of UPA come from? Has the Church always taught that “whoever the whole hierarchy currently recognizes must infallibly be pope”? Or is that a late, over-extended attempt to solve a different problem, now being weaponized to prop up a collapsing post-conciliar project?
I want to tell a story almost completely missing from the current debate. It begins long before Leo XIV, long before Vatican II, with theologians who were trying to defend the papacy from Protestants and Gallicans, not from trads on Twitter.
The older instinct: protect the faith, not the sociology
Decades before Vatican I, Catholic theologians were already wrestling with a question that sounds very modern: what if a man who is regarded as pope turns out not to be? What if there is a defect in his election, or he loses the faith? What happens to the Church’s indefectibility?
An 1868 article in The Dublin Review gives us a window into that world. Writing as a convinced ultramontane in the run-up to Vatican I, Dr. William George Ward surveys earlier theologians like Turrecremata and Suarez and frankly admits a possibility that today’s UPA apologists treat as blasphemy: a “seeming pope” who is universally regarded as pope, but in reality is not.
I first introduced Ward’s 1868 Dublin Review article into the online debate in a 2016 column for The Remnant (surreptitiously deleted by the Editor, but preserved in the web archive here). What follows is, in a sense, the continuation of that conversation; only this time without an editorial muzzle.
Ward acknowledges that some medievals believed a pope could, by falling into heresy, cease to be really pope while still being treated as pope by the Church. Faced with that hypothesis, he doesn’t panic and scream “schism.” He asks the right question: how does Christ protect His Church in such a scenario?
His answer is subtle and sane. He argues that once a man, already recognized as pope by the universal Church, truly puts forth a solemn, ex cathedra definition, divine Providence will not permit that man to be an impostor.
If the Church as a whole adheres to a dogma defined from the Chair of Peter, that very act is a dogmatic fact: God guarantees both the truth of the dogma and the reality of the pope.
Notice what Ward is not saying.
He is not saying that the bare sociological fact of “everyone externally treats him as pope” is itself a revealed dogma. He is not treating “universal acceptance” as an automatic sacrament that retroactively cures any defect whatsoever.
He is tying the divine protection to doctrine. The catastrophe he wants to exclude is not “the bishops were fooled for a time,” but “the Church is bound to heresy as Catholic dogma.” A “seeming pope” may sit on the throne; what God will not permit is that such a man, in that state, successfully bind the Church to false doctrine in the very act by which she is meant to be preserved.
That is a far cry from today’s mantra: “once the bishops accept him, the discussion is over.”
Vatican I: the dogma is infallibility, not UPA
Two years after Ward’s article, Vatican I defined papal primacy and infallibility. Pastor Aeternus solemnly laid down that when the Roman pontiff, speaking ex cathedra, defines a doctrine of faith or morals to be held by the whole Church, he enjoys that infallibility with which Christ willed His Church to be endowed.
Notice again what the council does not do. It does not define any particular theory about how we recognize that a man is pope in the first place. It does not mention “universal peaceful acceptance” by name. It does not say: “Whenever all the bishops with jurisdiction externally adhere to a claimant, this adherence is itself an object of divine and Catholic faith.”
The dogma is about what happens when Peter’s successor teaches under certain conditions. It is not about turning every sociological fact into a revealed truth. The council presupposes that the man on the Chair is truly pope. It does not canonize a single theological mechanism for certifying that fact in every possible case.
The post-Vatican I tightening: from prudence to absolutism
After 1870, though, the tone changes. Catholic theologians now find themselves arguing not only with Protestants and Gallicans, but with Old Catholics who reject Vatican I by attacking Pius IX himself. “Maybe he wasn’t a true pope. Maybe the council was invalid. Maybe the whole thing was a massive fraud.”
You can see the temptation. If you allow that the identity of the pope can be seriously doubted, the enemy has an easy way to undermine any uncomfortable council or definition: “Perhaps that man was never pope.” In the face of that threat, some theologians move from Ward’s modest position to something far more sweeping.
Cardinal Billot is the poster child for this trend. Writing in the early twentieth century, in his De Ecclesia Christi, he takes the older intuition, that the Church cannot be left indefinitely subject to a false rule of faith, and expresses it in maximal form. The peaceful and universal adherence of the Church to a determined pontiff, he says, is in itself an infallible sign of his legitimacy and of all the conditions requisite for legitimacy. God may allow long vacancies, he argues, and even doubts about particular elections; what He cannot permit is that the whole Church accept as pontiff one who is not truly and legitimately so.
Taken in context, Billot is trying to secure Catholic confidence against an Old Catholic style attack: “perhaps Pius IX was false, therefore Vatican I falls.” But look at how far the tone has shifted from Ward.
For Ward, universal recognition plus the act of solemnly teaching Catholic truth is where Providence shows its hand. For Billot, the mere sociological fact of peaceful universal adherence is declared an “infallible sign” of legitimacy and of every hidden condition. The focus has moved from dogma to sociology, from the content of teaching to the external posture of the hierarchy.
Even then, Billot is still writing in a world where the papacy, though often weak and compromising, is not openly blessing adulterous unions or announcing that the Church was wrong on the death penalty for two millennia. He is not imagining an episcopate formed in the spirit of Vatican II, shot through with religious liberty and ecumenism and the cult of conscience.
His confidence is historical as much as theological: despite Honorius and Liberius, God has in practice never allowed a manifest heretic to sit on the Chair, never allowed a clearly invalid conclave to stand. That historical optimism makes it easier to say, “He will never permit it.”
The internet apologists take it off the cliff
Fast-forward a century.
We now live after the council, after the Novus Ordo, after Assisi, after Amoris, after Fiducia Supplicans, after a catechism revision that tells us capital punishment is “inadmissible” as if the Fathers, Doctors, and popes who allowed it simply didn’t understand the dignity of the human person.
Into this mess comes a generation of online apologists and trad-adjacent clerics who have discovered Billot. They rip his most aggressive paragraph out of context and turn it into a cudgel:
All the bishops with jurisdiction accepted Paul VI in 1963. All the bishops accepted the council. All the bishops accept Francis and Leo XIV. Therefore, by the “infallible sign” of universal peaceful acceptance, it is absolutely certain they are true popes.
Therefore anything that looks like rupture, whether Communion for those living in adultery, blessings of homosexual couples, or condemnation of the death penalty, must be reconcilable with tradition. If you can’t see how, that is your problem. You are flirting with schism.
In other words, a late, maximalist reading of UPA has been elevated into a pseudo-dogma that sits above the actual content of the faith. It no longer serves the dogma of indefectibility; it is used to smother any practical recognition that indefectibility is being violated.
The difference between defending the faith and defending the regime
At this point the contrast becomes painfully clear.
Ward and the older ultramontanes were defending the faith. They were worried that a “seeming pope” might bind the Church to heresy and thus destroy her. Their solution was to stress that God’s protection operates at the level of doctrine: a man whom the Church universally receives as pope and who truly defines Catholic dogma can be trusted as both true pope and true teacher.
The post-Vatican I overcorrection, and especially the popular UPA apologetics today, are defending something else entirely: the regime. Their greatest horror is no longer “the Church might be bound to heresy,” but “someone might doubt that this particular innovator is truly pope.”
That is why they are willing to invert the order of reasoning. Instead of saying “we know he is pope because he teaches the faith,” they effectively say, “whatever he teaches must be Catholic because we know he is pope.” Universal acceptance has become a trump card to force the acceptance of innovations that, on their face, contradict prior magisterium.'
If you really follow their logic, it is absurd. A Catholic is told he must believe that Communion for those living in adultery is compatible with Trent’s teaching on mortal sin, that blessings for same-sex couples are compatible with two millennia of condemnation of sodomy, that a categorical rejection of the death penalty is compatible with centuries of papal and conciliar approval, because Billot once wrote that universal adherence is an “infallible sign” of legitimacy.
A late neo-ultramontane opinion about sociology is being used to bulldoze the actual, concrete content of faith and morals.
What we should retain – and what we should throw away
You do not need to deny the Church’s indefectibility to reject this hypertrophied version of UPA.
The Church cannot defect in the faith or make heresy the law of belief; Christ’s teaching authority remains in her even when its ordinary exercise is impeded. That much is Catholic doctrine.
It also makes sense, as a matter of prudence, to presume that a man long received by the Church and acting in substantial continuity with his predecessors is legitimately pope. It even makes sense to say that when such a man truly defines Catholic truth, that act is a dogmatic fact about both the doctrine and his authority.
What you do not have to accept, and what no council has ever defined, is the idea that the mere fact of “universal peaceful acceptance” by a traumatized, post-conciliar hierarchy is a blank check that makes Leo XIV untouchable, whatever he says or does. You are not bound to treat every white cassock that wins episcopal applause as an infallible sacrament of legitimacy.
There is a reason Ward’s Dublin Review essay could openly talk about a “seeming pope” and still count as loyal ultramontane theology. There is a reason Vatican I defined papal infallibility without ever mentioning UPA. There is a reason the older instinct located God’s protection at the level of doctrine rather than in sociological head-counts.
The tragic irony is that the very theologians who overcorrected after Vatican I did so out of a desire to guard Catholics against Protestant and Gallican attacks on the papacy. A century later, their tightened formulas are being used to bully Catholics into accepting what their eyes and catechisms tell them is a betrayal of the faith.
That is what has to be exposed. Not the dogma of papal infallibility. Not the indefectibility of the Church. The real target is the bloated, late-stage version of “universal peaceful acceptance” that has quietly replaced the faith itself with a vague confidence that whatever the current regime approves must somehow be Catholic.
Once you see how and why that overcorrection arose, it stops looking like a sacred tradition and starts looking like what it is: a well-intentioned but disastrous attempt to guarantee more than Christ ever promised.
And the moment you stop letting that opinion boss around your conscience, you are free to see what Ward and the medievals could still see clearly: the Church’s true safety lies in the content of the faith, not in the applause of bishops for whoever happens to be on the balcony.
ReplyDeleteEvil pedo masonic scum
This sort of comment deserves posting as it demonstrates a very common attitude towards the modern Vatican.
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ReplyDeleteChrist did not found the catholic church. the nicea council did in fear of christ. to pervert his teachings and obscure his message. this is why they sprinkle not full immersion baptism why they claim mary has some kind of divinty when she doesnt. why you can buy a certificate saying you are going to heaven. why they wear the hats for the fish god. its pure evil masquerading as holy.
Maff Hellno your comment qualifies as an anti-Catholic rant but will be posted as it gives an opportunity to explain an important aspect of Church doctrine.
DeleteWhy you missed out why you believe this Protestant propaganda: it's inspired by satan, who hates the Eucharist in the Catholic Mass because It is Jesus Christ, His Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity really and substantially present on the altar in Catholic churches.
ReplyDeleteMaff Hellno Absolutely. I was christianed a catltetic after my dad died 65 years ago with no true consent of my own in dead ignorance to thd truth oc Almighy Gods word. I learnt fast the errors of Catholism when I went to boarding school & swa the hypocrisy & rejected it. Lived in darkness without hope for 18 years through my juvenile state & saw the light of Christ after reading & taking in the holy word of God way back in 1985. It hasn't been easy but I was set Free from the bondage of this forsaken World & prospered in all ways since. Ps, I will not be accepting the digital id drivers license or anything that will create the loss of my God given FREEDOM. Its all about control by a rotten & evil system where by you live in subjection to the wicked rulers of this falling World & take it wherever they want to put it.The book of Revelations tells it all.
DeleteJeffery F Petersen et al, you make the basic but very understandable mistake of believing the conciliar, post-Bergoglian sect led by Robert Prevost ('Pope Leo') which has usurped the Vatican is the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. It's not.
It's an antichurch which has been prophesied by many mystics. The Catholic Church subsists still, and always, in the faithful 'Remnant' in the Traditional Latin Mass communities that Prevost/Leo needs to destroy.
DeleteJeffery F Petersen correct the system they are quietly building is the system whereby if you dont take the mark you will not be able to buy or sell. the W.E.F is currently working on a digital tattoo for everyone to have. sounds ominous doesnt it. we all are aware with digital id and cbdc's they will be able to turn of your ability to buy and sell. so... any christian worth his salt will refuse as he knows where it leads and its not worth our souls. take my head but you wont take my soul.
DeleteMaff Hellno I agree but please realise that while Leo's Vatican is thoroughly globalist, the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church will refuse Davos Inc's plans for digital ID.
DeleteJulia du Fresne I believe no such conciliar. There is only one to believe & he died for your sin & wickedness Julia a cruel death that we may live in Freedom & peace . But the end is near where the foolish loose there freedom to the bondage of the Beast system which I'm sure you know.I make no mistake with that statement. Matthew 24 & Revelations tells the end time disaster very clearly. Jesus declared very simply. I am the way the truth & the life, nobody comes to the father but by me. He did'nt say a word about joining a religion .He said I have come to set the captives free & you shall be free indeed.He is was & is to come again after the masses follow the Beast to there own demise & destruction because they follow the ruler of this world who sets himself up as god on earth. But only for a short time as it is written. Jesus said ( I will come again) John chp 14 v 3, but first all these things must come. Its showdown time between good & evil ..One day to God is as one thousand years to man don't forget that.Life is very short in the flesh when you consider Gods plan for humanity. Salvation thru Christ. Julia de Fresne. Non of what you say means anything in the scheme of Gods plan .
Jeffery F Petersen, He did indeed 'say a word' about founding a religion. He said, "Thou are Peter and upon this rock (petrus) I will build my church and the gates of hell shall never prevail against it." Only the Catholic Church can demonstrate its succession, pope by pope for over 2000 years, to St Peter, the first bishop of Rome.
Delete"Upon this rock": The words of Christ to Peter, spoken in the vulgar language of the Jews which our Lord made use of, were the same as if he had said in English, Thou art a Rock, and upon this rock I will build my church. So that, by the plain course of the words, Peter is here declared to be the rock, upon which the church was to be built: Christ himself being both the principal foundation and founder of the same. Where also note, that Christ, by building his house, that is, his church, upon a rock, has thereby secured it against all storms and floods, like the wise builder, [Matt 7:24-25].
[18] "The gates of hell": That is, the powers of darkness, and whatever Satan can do, either by himself, or his agents. For as the church is here likened to a house, or fortress, built on a rock; so the adverse powers are likened to a contrary house or fortress, the gates of which, that is, the whole strength, and all the efforts it can make, will never be able to prevail over the city or church of Christ. By this promise we are fully assured, that neither idolatry, heresy, nor any pernicious error whatsoever shall at any time prevail over the church of Christ.
Julia du Fresne And so they should if they have any idea where it leads too. Hell on earth .Julia du Fresne And so they should if they have any idea where it leads too. Hell on earth .
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